Curse

Shasgaliel · Sep 10, 2008, 09:05 AM // 09:05

I went through so many threads already and almost everywhere there are complaints regarding how bad the PUGs are. I know there were some threads before but I think it will be nice to start a new one to discuss the current situation.

I know most of you do not PUG anymore and the reasons are more or less obvious. The question is how to make PUGs more attractive or at least improve them so that they are not so much pain anymore. I think suggestions can be funny or serious. Maybe something smart will pop out. Of course suggestions like remove heroes or henchmen are not welcomed since they will not make PUGs more acceptable but will make even more people leave the game.

My first proposal would be to add word NOOB to the list of words which are displayed in "...." format.

Add report option for drawing genitals on the mini map.

After three lines filled only with caps team chat is disabled for a given player for the next 5 minutes. No more OMFG OMFG spams.

PUG leader can see the skill bars of the players asking to be invited to the party and the ones (+heroes) already in the party.

Limit MOX heroes to maximum 2 for a party (at least for the next two weeks).

Add a possibility to have a platform on which you can display to your team several builds (for you and your heroes) one under another.

Person going afk is voted by all other team members - if you go afk you have a button I am going afk and estimated time. Other team members vote. If anyone votes no or person does not click afk button the following option is turned on: If someone is afk for more than 5 minutes or by 5 minutes exceeded the time set before then all drops (including chests and end chests) are disabled for this person unless all other non afk-team members agree by voting. This is not perfect but will limit leachers (unfortunately not leavers). Of course someone can argue that many things happen in RL and then person will be excluded but then there is a vote option.

etc etc etc.

Unfortunately I have absolutely no idea how to reduce a chance of getting a moron in a PUG. Probably whole this tread is pointless at this stage of the game but I can still see light at the end of the tunnel. I hope I am not alone.

Numa Pompilius · Sep 10, 2008, 09:18 AM // 09:18

For what it's worth... the reason I H/H instead of PUG isn't because PUGs are bad, normally they're faster and more efficient than hero-henching, but that they don't let me play the way I want. I don't want to rush, and I'm not playing to farm loot, so I and PUGs don't mix.

Hyper.nl · Sep 10, 2008, 09:22 AM // 09:22

Pugs are underrated imo. I got all of these with pugs or hero/henchway. For all normal mode storyline missions Pugs generally work excellent. Only hard mode and elite missions/area's can prove too much for many PuGs.

Of course, measures are needed against leavers and morons. I would /sign every measure against people who draw crap in compass. I also would love to see the AI taking over the character of a leaver, as suggested before.

Engage · Sep 10, 2008, 09:27 AM // 09:27

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

For what it's worth... the reason I H/H instead of PUG isn't because PUGs are bad, normally they're faster and more efficient than hero-henching, but that they don't let me play the way I want. I don't want to rush, and I'm not playing to farm loot, so I and PUGs don't mix.

This........

I want to do things how I want. If I want to eat a sandwich and watch Corner Gas in the middle of a dungeon then so be it.

You know right away what you are dealing with when you join a pug. Those willing to compromise build wise and actually talk beforehand about what's to be done are the people you want to play with.

Cebe · Sep 10, 2008, 09:36 AM // 09:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

Limit MOX heroes to maximum 2 for a party (at least for the next two weeks).

I sympathise with this comment.

Because he's new people seem to just want to use him all the time.

I got in a PuG for defeating N.O.X. with 3 M.O.X. heroes in it. I asked if at least one could be removed for a BHA ranger and was told by someone "No M.O.X. is good and has a good build that works for me". I questioned why there were THREE M.O.X. heroes, and even pointed out that M.O.X. wasn't even a requirement for the quest....the only response I got was one guy pinging his leet Avatar of Balthazar Dervish build packed with 15-energy enchantments and 10-energy attacks, followed by him telling me how he managed his energy well. Yea...I bet.

I left.

That being said, I have had some fun in R.O.X., N.O.X. and P.O.X. PuGs. They're not all bad if you choose well and leave the stupid ones to fail without you.

gerlin · Sep 10, 2008, 09:43 AM // 09:43

The reason i LIKE pugs are because sometimes I don't have to take point all the time :/, i don't care if they are retards as long as they provide me with a meat wall. But i usally still end up taking point (even with monk i have to aggro the mobs because those wussies are to scared to die, even when i'm pro-healing them). And if i'm not leading they at least aggro 2 mobs at a time.
But hey, thats always a laugh and a lesson to listen to my warnings.
A second reason why i pug is because you can chat with others and they sometimes ping their builds. Half the time i'm almost literally roflmao'ing.

But yea, the only annoying thing in pugs are leavers and leechers.
Leechers can be disposed by putting in a rule that when not active for 15 min he gets replaced by a henchy of the same profession, and he is send back to the outpost and like in pvp hexed with "for 10 min you can't do any missions". This will also annoy people who run but moving once every 5 min ain't that hard. As for leavers, if someone leaves with atleast 75% party members remaining, they are also hexed with " For 5 min you are not allowed to go on any missions. Also you have -5 health regen and 0 zero pipes of energy regen."
If that doesn't stop leavers and leechers nothing will

.

I never have any trouble with people wanting to bring mox. IF i see one i strong urge them to take an MM instead

, and i can be very persuasive.

AnbuAdam · Sep 10, 2008, 09:51 AM // 09:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

I went through so many threads already and almost everywhere there are complaints regarding how bad the PUGs are. I know there were some threads before but I think it will be nice to start a new one to discuss the current situation.

I know most of you do not PUG anymore and the reasons are more or less obvious. The question is how to make PUGs more attractive or at least improve them so that they are not so much pain anymore. I think suggestions can be funny or serious. Maybe something smart will pop out. Of course suggestions like remove heroes or henchmen are not welcomed since they will not make PUGs more acceptable but will make even more people leave the game.

My first proposal would be to add word NOOB to the list of words which are displayed in "...." format.

Add report option for drawing genitals on the mini map.

After three lines filled only with caps team chat is disabled for a given player for the next 5 minutes. No more OMFG OMFG spams.

PUG leader can see the skill bars of the players asking to be invited to the party and the ones (+heroes) already in the party.

Limit MOX heroes to maximum 2 for a party (at least for the next two weeks).

Add a possibility to have a platform on which you can display to your team several builds (for you and your heroes) one under another.

Person going afk is voted by all other team members - if you go afk you have a button I am going afk and estimated time. Other team members vote. If anyone votes no or person does not click afk button the following option is turned on: If someone is afk for more than 5 minutes or by 5 minutes exceeded the time set before then all drops (including chests and end chests) are disabled for this person unless all other non afk-team members agree by voting. This is not perfect but will limit leachers (unfortunately not leavers). Of course someone can argue that many things happen in RL and then person will be excluded but then there is a vote option.

etc etc etc.

Unfortunately I have absolutely no idea how to reduce a chance of getting a moron in a PUG. Probably whole this tread is pointless at this stage of the game but I can still see light at the end of the tunnel. I hope I am not alone.

I'll go down the list and agree/disagree:

1)I don't get why you would want to do that. Its not vulgarity.

2)Yes. Its very annoying when people draw on the map obnoxiously, or at least make a way to know who is doing that.

3)Yes. But not just all caps because some guy will go OMg

4)Absolutely agree 100%

5)No, M.O.X is awesome.(As long as you give him a good build).

6)Yes.

7)Yes.

I'd also like to add, a report function for leechers in PvE, or at least a way to vote kick so they dont chest drops during my CoF run. Or, being a leech in general.

Etta · Sep 10, 2008, 09:53 AM // 09:53

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

This tread is probably pointless at this stage of the game.

And yet, here we are.

Lykan · Sep 10, 2008, 10:15 AM // 10:15

I went pugging the mox quests a few times. And had some pugs trying to bring mox with them, I asked them all the same question.

"Would you have brought a dervish hero in a group last week?"

Everytime they all got sheepish and switched the mox's for something else.

Quote:

Originally Posted by AnbuAdam

5)No, M.O.X is awesome.(As long as you give him a good build).

and lol

Miska Bow · Sep 10, 2008, 10:20 AM // 10:20

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

.... but I can still see light at the end of the tunnel. I hope I am not alone.

That light you see is the Failling PuG train coming in fast.

White Lies · Sep 10, 2008, 01:01 PM // 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

My first proposal would be to add word NOOB to the list of words which are displayed in "...." format..

They are about to leave anyway when they shout that, so just ignore it. Its thier loss :P

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

Add report option for drawing genitals on the mini map.

Agreed.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

After three lines filled only with caps team chat is disabled for a given player for the next 5 minutes. No more OMFG OMFG spams..

Ignore the player, then ask the rest when hes stopped then romove him from the ignore list. Works for me ^^.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

PUG leader can see the skill bars of the players asking to be invited to the party and the ones (+heroes) already in the party..

Dont like this idea. Removes voluntarity. Imagine i was messing with a build for the lols and i joined a party for a mission i needed: the PuG lead sees the build im running, has a quick scan of the skill thinks 'omg noob' and kicks me.
Pinging skills should be a voluntary action from the players, if they dont want to ping, they get kicked. Pinging a build, in my experience at least, can help you make the build better with one of the players saying 'i run xxxx with this, it helps with xxxx'. Thats how i see pinging should work. Afterwards it depends on the players and the leaders.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shasgaliel

Add a possibility to have a platform on which you can display to your team several builds (for you and your heroes) one under another.

Dont understand this :S

The pinging is the only thing i feel strongly about, the rest of the ideas are really good though.

~Lies

oh also like the dihonerable style title for leavers, and the AI replacement.

The Red Messenger · Sep 10, 2008, 01:17 PM // 13:17

Pugs will only be good for new people. when the game first came out, we were all noobs so pugs were good. henchie AI sucked and there were no heroes or the ability to flag. any human was generally better than his or her henchmen counterpart.

those days are gone. people only pug when they are feeling nice or are new to the game. basically you are gambling time when you pug.

the only solution i see is to have a real way to judge experience. titles and equipment do not work. possible a rating system might be interesting...

after a pug, your party can rate your performance, and this rating can be displayed like a title if you choose. it would have to be set up so the same person cant rate you twice in a given time period. actually now that i think about it this idea is stupid and would never work

The Meth · Sep 10, 2008, 01:34 PM // 13:34

Mandatory intelligence tests implemented in game, with the players score displayed in a 2nd, permanent title.

That's what you want.

R_Frost · Sep 10, 2008, 01:51 PM // 13:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Numa Pompilius

For what it's worth... the reason I H/H instead of PUG isn't because PUGs are bad, normally they're faster and more efficient than hero-henching, but that they don't let me play the way I want. I don't want to rush, and I'm not playing to farm loot, so I and PUGs don't mix.

exactly. H/H allows me the freedom to play at my own pace. if i need to walk away from the computer for a few min while in the middle of something H/H dont get pissed and leave. give us 7 heros and im sure most stuff could be done just as fast and maybe faster then a full human group, except for maybe the elite areas.

N1ghtstalker · Sep 10, 2008, 01:52 PM // 13:52

put "go to pvxwiki" in the menu
maybe people will actually look then

Shasgaliel · Sep 10, 2008, 01:57 PM // 13:57

Quote:

Originally Posted by White Lies

Dont understand this :S

.

I was thinking that it will be nice to have a possibility of pinging builds several at one time in a bulk way. Lets say you put your build/builds and your heroes build in this platform/window/box/whatever and a whole team sees it nicely one next to another. I will be much easier to see what is in the team and what is missing. There would be less scrolling through the chat to find a every build pinged by someone. It will be also easier if you want to discuss which one to take.

Damian979 · Sep 10, 2008, 02:29 PM // 14:29

Allow the leeching report function to be used for PvE. (Makes no sense to me why it isn't already)

Allow the dishonor hex to be used in PvE for x# of reports for verbal abuse, leeching, etc.

Add a message box before entering mission areas where all team members click "ok" to eliminate the "ZOMGWTF I was merching/making a build/storing stuff/wanking I didn't type 111" /ragequit.

Add an option within party search to see what classes are already in a party you may potentially want to join or get invited to. "Wth there are 6 W/ and a Me/, I'm an E/, why did you waste my time?"

Calista Blackblood · Sep 10, 2008, 02:55 PM // 14:55

make the tutorial non skippable

gremlin · Sep 10, 2008, 03:00 PM // 15:00

Only party leader able to draw on mini map others can just ping

Other annoying behaviour lparty dumps player and carries on or return to town dump player and start again.
Learn by talking to players to distinguish potential idiots.

Seeing others skill bars pinging them etc nope none of your business besides its pretty easy to change the skill bar after pinging and being accepted.
See above how to distinguish potential idiots.

Go back to the old ways of pugging ie
Party looking for MM necro
SS necro LFG
Interupt ranger needed for mission etc

As for MOX while I agree too many huge golems could get annoying just how many pugs use more than one maybe two heroes anyway.
I find its usually a pug short a Monk or a Warrior that grabs a couple of heroes rather than wait for enough players.

The AFK problem is annoying it always has been and players jumping ship because they are after survivor title.
Little you can do except live with it just talk to the players about how long this is going to take and are they ok with that.

You have to trust people sometimes.

Evil_Necro · Sep 10, 2008, 03:13 PM // 15:13

Quote:

Originally Posted by Celestial Beaver

I sympathise with this comment.

Because he's new people seem to just want to use him all the time.

I got in a PuG for defeating N.O.X. with 3 M.O.X. heroes in it. I asked if at least one could be removed for a BHA ranger and was told by someone "No M.O.X. is good and has a good build that works for me". I questioned why there were THREE M.O.X. heroes, and even pointed out that M.O.X. wasn't even a requirement for the quest....the only response I got was one guy pinging his leet Avatar of Balthazar Dervish build packed with 15-energy enchantments and 10-energy attacks, followed by him telling me how he managed his energy well. Yea...I bet.

I left.

THIS, THIS THIS THIS!!!

My nightmare!!

omg!